Christmas and Santa

[JADE]

You are all so right about so much, but you already knew that. :kewl

First a question that I don't think I've ever seen an answer to, What exact day was Jesus born on and what day did he rise from the dead?

I've heard many variations of dates that they THINK are CLOSE to being correct, but I've yet to see a date that all agree on. So while I know and most Christians know that Dec.25 isn't truly the date he was born on, it is the date we celebrate. We do that with our kids all the time. If their birthdate falls in the middle of the week, we celebrate it on the weekend so we can put together a party or something. No biggy.

Now do we truly want to get really deep into the whole emaculate conception of an under aged virgin girl? Again, I think there is a time and age at which folks need to get into the literal and controversial specifics of it all. I fear that if we try to make it too hard and deep for our fellow men, they will fall even further from the truth or even the want of believing.

That doesn't mean I wish to spred lies, but if the secular and weak Christians want join in to celebrate Jesus, it is no great shame to allow a bit of poetic license, humor, incorrectness, etc. It only gives us more people to be open with and more to discuss with them.

So JAM, put away that sharp stick before you poke someone in the eye with it. :rofl

[Invisible_2_no1]

My opinion is that again, steeped into tradition, man has followed what he's been told for so many years by the church.

Christ, if he was born in December, would not have had flocks of sheep and shepherds coming to visit Him, because the sheep would be freezing their fleece off.



And also take into consideration the consensus that Herod declared which gave the reason why they were where they were to begin with.

Ever see "The Annals of the World" by Ussher JADE?

It's a great history book.

Lots of stuff we believers do and when doesn't line up with the times of history back then.

OKey Dokey, putting my stick away.

But remember, Sissy's got me covered...:EVIL GRIN:

[JADE]

Never read the book, but I'm sure I can find a few more that agree and disagree with parts of it also. Thats the problem with trying to be perfect, it just won't happen. Remember, there are many that also have books that say Jesus was just a prophet and/or that he never existed in the first place.

So I doubt if we will ever know for sure when he was born or if there were 3 kings or many of the other things that have been past down through time. But in the meantime, I let others and myself celebrate Jesus birth on the 25th of Dec.

If we don't watch it, they'll stop that and every other thing that even sounds Christian. They tried real hard last Christmas and are only now starting to realize how it affected not only there sales, but the attitudes of the American people.

And I'm not scared of anyone named SISSY. :rofl

[Sissy]

Nope. We are not told the exact date of the birth of Jesus.

And there may be a very good reason why we are not told the date. Could be that it was not meant to be made into a holiday.
We do have exact times of when the festivals of the Lord were; the ones that God ordained.
But we have a world full of Christians who couldn't tell you squat about any of the God ordained festivals. And yet, it was these God ordained festivals that actually pointed to Christ.

But there is nothing in scripture that connects the Christmas season with Christ.
But we do have scriptures that connect it with pagan idolotry.


"Put Christ back in Christmas"
Why? He was never part of pagan idolotry to start with.


"Jesus is the reason for the season"
Why do we teach that when God never did?

[Dan Bittleston]

A little "scientific" history about this event.

Were the Wise Men: Astrologers?

Were the "The Wise Men" of the Nativity story practicing astrology when they went to Bethlehem in search of Jesus? This intricate biblical tale actually offers numerous clues, and the answer appears to be yes.

Wisdom of the Magi
"Magician" is a derivative of "magi," the most learned members of the ancient Persian sect of Zoroastrianism. Groups of magi would travel to the farthest reaches of the known world seeking to understand mystical truths; astrology was one of their central concerns.

The biblical story of Jesus' birth tells us a lot about the Magi's astrological thinking: they came from the East, followed a star that indicated the king of Judea was about to be born in the West, and were told by King Herod that prophecy predicted this king would be born in Bethlehem.

Astrologers did wander the ancient earth observing natural phenomena, Persia (present-day Iran) was east of Judea (present-day Israel), and King Herod did in fact rule Judea until his death in 4 B.C.

Charting Jesus' birth
What astrological phenomena were in place for Jesus' birth? The first step is to determine a birth year; the year and date Christians celebrate today were randomly assigned by the church hundreds of years later.

Throughout history, zodiac signs have defined the personalities of countries and kingdoms, just as they do for people. For example, the Declaration of Independence was signed on July 4,1776, making the United States a Cancer.

Here are the key astrological facts that the Magi would have known as they sought to witness the birth of the historical Jesus:

Ancient Judea was thought to be an Aries (the Ram's Horn, for instance, figures into many ancient Jewish traditions)
1. Jupiter was considered the planet of royalty
2. The zodiac sign of royalty was Leo
3. Leo's ruling planet is the Sun

The next question is: When during Herod's reign would Jupiter, the planet of Kings, have been in Aries, the sign of Judea?

The answer is that the Sun was in Aries from late March through late April of the year 5 B.C. Since the Magi were following the Eastern "star" of Jupiter, they would have been looking for the birth to occur when Jupiter was brightest in the Eastern horizon. This would have occurred before sunrise and with no moonlight.

Christmas in April?
On April 16th, 5 B.C., at 4:58 a.m. in Bethlehem, Judea, Jupiter rose over the eastern horizon, shining as brightly as it would in Aries for many years. The Moon was so close to the Sun that it created no ambient light to distract from Jupiter, which was the brightest object in the heavens until the Sun rose, at least 40 minutes later.

Was this the moment of Jesus' birth? We'll never know for sure -- but surely it's no accident that the Nativity story describes in great detail how a star in the sky would signal Jesus' coming birth. Astrology was one of the early Church's key rhetorical weapons in its attempt to convert pagans throughout the Roman Empire. Pointing to the Eastern Star as a signal of Christ's divinity, for instance, was a crucial line of church reasoning in the first millennium A.D.

As for those "The Wise Men", their belief in astrology seems almost beyond dispute. After all, they're known to have brought the infant Jesus gold, frankincense and myrrh, all precious commodities in the ancient world. And if these magi weren't entirely certain of what the stars had to tell them, they wouldn't have left such riches, intended for the most royal of births, in the poorest of mangers.

http://astrology.msn.com/horoscopes/...reewisemen.asp

[Sissy]

Originally Posted by JADE

And I'm not scared of anyone named SISSY. :rofl

Wise indeed, JADE. Wise indeed.

Matthew 10:28 And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.


:thup2

[Being Conformed]

Originally Posted by Stan

Why do you suppose he did that?

Is this rhetorical?

It was about fifteen minutes after he posted as Gabriel that he allegedly started posting as BB and then had eight post in thirty five minutes, give or take. Then came the shout box at the same time of his last post and was short lived.

Since the IP was the same, I assume, have you checked that same IP with other banned posters? He reminds me of a certain someone who is purposely inarticulate at times to hide who he is. But he's smart. The fact that he called you guys 'fundies' and said what he did about 'theory and fact' might be a give-away.

I'm not a moderator there - I am a poster just like I am here - so since I'm the only one posting on this site about that situation I assume you are addressing me.... Am I correct? I know gabriel is very intelligent - I was on to him/her to a certain extent - it was obvious not a believer. I was suspicious as soon as bayou bob logged in right after gabriel was banned - I'm not a mod there it's not my job to train them. (sorry if I sound rude that's not my attitude :kewl )

He was basically setting everyone up. So we need to be more careful how we approach people.

Setting everyone up for what?

My opinion is that he was handled badly.....again.
He got what he wanted and that's what he wanted everyone to see.

Which was, please?

I could be wrong on this,
so take it with a grain of salt.

Well, I'll wait for your responses and he/she dealt with several ppl - I never feel it is 'wrong' to witness to, refute and ask where a person stands. God forbid I even 'lied' to him/her - saying I had a PhD. One thing I noticed he was more responsive in general to Cindy and I that to the males. He has a lot of anger and any provacation exposed that - he wasn't as rude to "T"as the other males who had tempers of their own. That's my 'professional' opinion

[Being Conformed]

Originally Posted by Sissy

Discovery

I actually met this 'kid' although he was an adult obviously at the time - I have a little statue signed by him I lost the box though - oh well no biggie

[Sissy]

This is a link to a house decorated with lights.
The lights are synchronized to music.

http://www.trykoskichristmas.com/vid...nter-small.wmv


IT'S WILD!!!!

[Stan]

Originally Posted by Being Conformed

Is this rhetorical?

No, it's not. I'm still scrathing my head a bit on the whole matter.

The reason is the past....for starters....


universal reconciliation (http://www.christianwebsite.com/talk...ead.php?t=9558)

If you read one of my latest responses, Gabriel asked me "have we met?" Because I had said, "It's been a while"

I was watching, and I remember him and Tony. Tony and I exchanged a couple of post back then.

I'm not a moderator there - I am a poster just like I am here - so since I'm the only one posting on this site about that situation I assume you are addressing me.... Am I correct?

Yes....

I know gabriel is very intelligent - I was on to him/her to a certain extent - it was obvious not a believer. I was suspicious as soon as bayou bob logged in right after gabriel was banned - I'm not a mod there it's not my job to train them. (sorry if I sound rude that's not my attitude :kewl )

I don't think you sound rude at all. I can say I was not "on to him" but I was in PM with Gabriel. Just a couple while he was posting. I addressed remembering the last time he was at CWS posting. He had called me presumptuous. But my presumption wasn't without its merits.

Setting everyone up for what?

To justify 'Christian Universalism.' Every question he asked had that common denominator to make a point.

Which was, please?

Perception, of course. Without reading Gabriels post's, go back and read the responses to him. The double standard still stands mighty. I think he went off because he was angry at the way he was treated from the get go. My perception was, that it built up.

Do you know what bayou could stand for?

Bare assing you...bob.

Because he was just banned.

It's just a thought.
I laughed when I seen it.



And then I think he was messing with you all about being an atheist. He was angry and perhaps had a shortcoming. I only base that on past history and just a little common sense. Like I said, I'm still scratching my head on that one. I don't have the answer. What does your PhD tell you?

Well, I'll wait for your responses and he/she dealt with several ppl - I never feel it is 'wrong' to witness to, refute and ask where a person stands.

I agree.

God forbid I even 'lied' to him/her - saying I had a PhD. One thing I noticed he was more responsive in general to Cindy and I that to the males. He has a lot of anger and any provacation exposed that - he wasn't as rude to "T"as the other males who had tempers of their own. That's my 'professional' opinion

A PhD doesn't mean God gave one who has one wisdom. Gabriel was cordial to me in our PM's. We understood each others salt. He wouldn't condemn me to hell so long I gave the same respect. It was in good humor. I told him I would be very slow in responding. I wanted to throw something out there and see where it went.

quick to listen, slow to speak.....

I thought Titus made a few good points in the spiritual warfare. There was frustration and sarcasm on both sides. And I liked Esthers post, even though it was mostly scripture emphasized, I got it.

And I always like the way Hans replies, even when he disagrees.

[Being Conformed]

Originally Posted by Stan

No, it's not. I'm still scrathing my head a bit on the whole matter.

The reason is the past....for starters....


universal reconciliation (http://www.christianwebsite.com/talk...ead.php?t=9558)

If you read one of my latest responses, Gabriel asked me "have we met?" Because I had said, "It's been a while"

I was watching, and I remember him and Tony. Tony and I exchanged a couple of post back then.






Yes....




I don't think you sound rude at all. I can say I was not "on to him" but I was in PM with Gabriel. Just a couple while he was posting. I addressed remembering the last time he was at CWS posting. He had called me presumptuous. But my presumption wasn't without its merits.




To justify 'Christian Universalism.' Every question he asked had that common denominator to make a point.




Perception, of course. Without reading Gabriels post's, go back and read the responses to him. The double standard still stands mighty. I think he went off because he was angry at the way he was treated from the get go. My perception was, that it built up.

Do you know what bayou could stand for?

Bare assing you...bob.

Because he was just banned.

It's just a thought.
I laughed when I seen it.



And then I think he was messing with you all about being an atheist. He was angry and perhaps had a shortcoming. I only base that on past history and just a little common sense. Like I said, I'm still scratching my head on that one. I don't have the answer. What does your PhD tell you?





I agree.





A PhD doesn't mean God gave one who has one wisdom. Gabriel was cordial to me in our PM's. We understood each others salt. He wouldn't condemn me to hell so long I gave the same respect. It was in good humor. I told him I would be very slow in responding. I wanted to throw something out there and see where it went.

quick to listen, slow to speak.....

I thought Titus made a few good points in the spiritual warfare. There was frustration and sarcasm on both sides. And I liked Esthers post, even though it was mostly scripture emphasized, I got it.

And I always like the way Hans replies, even when he disagrees.

Okay, first I don't even know you. Second I don't know who 'Tony' is??? I don't have a PhD - it was a joke.(Maybe an honorary one - lol). Also, your remark about wisdom and a PhD is a bit brash. Wisdom comes from God I am well aware of that - thank you!

So your point is? You don't approve of my posts ????? Seriously, I don't claim to be the sharpest tool in the shed so you'll have spell it out for me what point/points you are trying to make here.

gabriel was provoked and sarcasm existed on both sides I agree. For the most part it was Titus, me, hb, responding to him and yes others did as well - Esther, Roy, Hans, you once or twice. Yes, he used several accroynms that I was not able to figure out. Kudos to you that you are so brilliant to figure out the bayou bob.

Also, you didn't state 'whom' could have handled things better or what his IP address had to do with me?

I'll await your answers.

Good day.

[Sissy]

:fix

Page wasn't showing up in index

[Stan]

BC,

You're right, the comment I made about the PhD was brash. Please except my apology for that one. I actually, because of what you posted earlier, thought you might have had a PhD. :blus4

[JADE]

Originally Posted by Sissy

This is a link to a house decorated with lights.
The lights are synchronized to music.

http://www.trykoskichristmas.com/vid...nter-small.wmv


IT'S WILD!!!!

I love the Trans Siberian Orchestra. I messed up and missed their show here in San Diego on Nov. 28th. Although I only found out about it like 2 days before they played.

Thats another house than the one that went around last year.

[Being Conformed]

Originally Posted by Stan

BC,

You're right, the comment I made about the PhD was brash. Please except my apology for that one. I actually, because of what you posted earlier, thought you might have had a PhD. :blus4

Apology accepted. I'll just take it as a compliment - (Look just don't tell JADE because he's always bringing his 'issues' to me :hep2 {clears throat} he is very passive aggressive feigns 'forgetting' to clean out his pm box or respond then goes into denial saying he never received a pm from me) it's sad.

Stan,

As we discussed privately - it's a pleasure to meet you and I'm glad that we were able to resolve this misunderstanding. Last I heard 'gabs' showed up again and it wasn't pretty. :trol

God Bless! :nond